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Topic Subject:Strategy Central - Build orders and strategies databank
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Bendak
Dúnadan
posted 04-15-06 12:30 PM EDT (US)         
Strategy Central


Introduction and Rules

Hey guys. This thread is made to contain all strategies you make and have them concentrated on one point - so you can easily find what you need. It will make it a lot easier for everyone to post their build order and find ones for the faction they seek help of. Though, to make this work properly, there need to be some rules.

  • Posted strategies should be in this form:

    Build Order (BO):
    -farm
    -barracks
    -farm
    -etc.

    Explanation
    You soldier rush to rangers blablabla etc.

  • You do not get credit for your strategy.

    Why? Because you may have gotten it from an other site, copied it from someone else, and such. You contribute a strategy for the sake of the community, not for your own glory.

  • Look if your strategy perhaps already is posted.

    We don't need 20 examples of the axe thrower rush. Have a look if your strategy is new enough or really contributes to the thread.

  • A strategy first needs to be confirmed by me.

    I'll have a small check to see if the strategy is worthwhile, and is suited to appear on this list. Using some simple BBcode to fluff it up helps a bit. Do not start posting thousands of strategies, preferably, submit one of your favorites and which really works well.

  • Replays help!

    If you have any replay of someone that performs this strategy, submit it and link to it! Not only does that greatly increase your success of getting onto the list, it helps a lot! Though, please do NOT post ownage replays of defeating noobs/newbies with ease. The opponent is preferably of the same skill as you.


    ROTWK only strategies

    The fire arrow ranger rush

    Army: Men

    BO

    Farm
    Farm
    Archery range
    farm
    lvl 2 archery range
    farm
    rangers
    fire arrows
    farm
    barracks
    rangers
    borimir
    stables
    knights

    This dosen't work against angmar, since they have a fast cavalry rush, but it murders the slow, short ranged dwarven axe throwers. you will get your first ranger battalion just in time to counter the first wave of anything. but they will probably die, but since you have a huge economy, you can keep popping out rangers that will be able to eventualy kill their first wave. after that, you get fire arrows and now you are unbeatable. I like to support my rangers with soldiers and knights just to split the fire of their forces. i mainly use boromir just to deal with enemy hero's.


    Men of the West strategies

    Soldiers a la extreme

    Build Order
    -Farm
    -Barracks
    -Farm
    -Soldiers
    -Attack enemy buildings with with buffed infantry
    -Soldiers
    -barracks near enemy base
    -Farm
    -soldiers
    -soldiers
    -more barracks and soldiers, tower guards if needed
    -etc

    Explanation
    You have soldiers attacking the enemys buildings first such as unit producing buildings and resource producing buildings and then there fortress. With a few battalians of infantry you can take down the fotress easily. Also, note that in the begining, the soldiers should go for the buildings NOT the enemies units.


    Dwarven strategies

    Axe thrower rush

    Build Order
    -mine + archery range
    -mine near enemies base
    -2 axe throwers
    -mine
    -2 axe throwers
    -mine
    -forge
    -2 axe throwers
    -battlewagon/upgrades (choose)
    -more mines
    -2 axe throwers.
    -dain

    Description
    Basically, you cripple your opponent very early. If it is possible, go for the fortress and destroy it right away. It is possible with axe throwers + rallying call. Axe throwers are an overpowered unit, especially versus Mordor. As long as you mass them, you have a solid chance of defeating your opponent. Mid-Late game won't be much of a worry if your rush works well, but I suggest getting a battlewagon for harassing, and King Dain for the leadership.


    Elven strategies

    Silverthorn Overload

    Build Order
    -2 Mallorn Trees
    -Barracks
    -Lorien Archers
    -Mallorn Tree
    -Lorien Archers
    -Mallorn Tree
    -Lorien Swordsmen / Mithlond Pikemen
    -Mallorn Tree
    -More Lorien Archers
    -Eregion Forge
    -Thranduil or Legolas if needed

    Description
    The basic principal is that you should protect your base and resources while outputting a steady supply of archers to fend off rushes or full out attacks, until you have enough resources to build an Eregion Forge. Once you do this, upgrade the forge as fast as possible, while also keeping your supply of archers at a premium (perhaps 3 battalions and 2-3 battalions of swordsmen / pikemen). Once you have the silverthorn arrows, upgrade your battalions and go mash. Remember to have a mixed army of pikemen, swordsmen and archers. You will be owned if you just go out there with archers expecting the silverthorn arrows to do all the work for you.

    The Lancer Rush (only early game)

    BO.

    2x Mallorn Tree.
    Stables (hidden!)
    1xLancers.
    Barracks...

    Explanation

    To tell you the truth this is a simple cavalry rush, I'm surprised it isn't already up there on the list, as I've succesfully used it many times. Here's how it works.

    -The aim is to cripple, not to crush. That means buildings and killing them, I'd start with the one's in range of his fort, why? Because you can kill them whilst you have your entire squad intact, and thus do it fastest. Try and go for unit production buildings first, then farms and what not. DO NOT get your squad killed, a couple of buildings will put them to lvl 2, the banner will help heal and they are expensive so it is imperative that they live, when in doubt...be cautious.

    A Few tips.

    -Rally Call is a MUST! You're Lancers cannot hack it without upgrades or Rally Call, you need at least one of those to make them an effective force.

    -USE THOSE STANCES! If you aren't hitting buildings, defensive stance...if you are, aggressive. Simple as that. Lancer HP is low enough, leaving them on neutral stacne will only hasten them to the grave!

    -HIDE YOUR STABLES! Chances are, his infantry will hit you at roughly the same time your cavalry hits him, on larger maps, you may hit a bit sooner. That Stables is expensive, so you want it well hid, you'll probably need it later.

    -Keep it to 1 squad of Lancers! They are not rohirrim, they are easily countered, but make fine raiders imho, also cavalry rush is not something people expect when they fight vs elves. The strategys success relies on a successful and clean switch to infantry/archers (i've left that non specific becuz ur choice should depend on what your opponent has, when in doubt, go archers). Lancers alone will not win the game, but they will make it easier

    -DON'T LOSE THE RUSH SQUAD! I repeat again for emphasis, the banner will heal them. If they don't get lvl 2 at least from their raiding, you haven't hit him hard enough.

    EXTRA: Zimland's advice

    Elves vs Men:
    What I've been working on is "Elven Spam".

    It's counter-intuitive since elves are so expensive, but I've had more luck with this than with any other plan.

    Basically:
    Tree/Tree/Barracks

    Always have a unit coming out of the barracks. Roughly 1/3rd Lorien Archers and 2/3rds Pikemen, or heavier on the pikes, depending on how heavy MOTW are with cavalry.

    Keep making trees and more barracks. You actually want about 5+ barracks. Skip upgrades, skip heroes.

    Send "packets" around the map. A packet is a minimum of 1 pikeman and 1 lorien archer. They go around and look for farms and so forth and try to hurt the Men's ability to expand as well as keep them busy. Don't worry overmuch about managing your packets, concentrate on making more packets. You could use swordsmen but I prefer pikes because if the Men aren't paying attention, they can end up losing a group of cavalry by accidentally tramping your pikes. (Note: If you see pikes about to be trampled, put them into Porcupine Formation. Right after they get hit, switch them into Aggressive Stance.)

    As your economy improves, packets turn into armies.

    You run into Boromir and a bunch of rangers. Boromir blows his horn and Rangers kill your entire army.

    Well, you have 6 barracks. You replace your army almost instantly and attack again. Boromir's horn is recycling and the Rangers just used up Longshot, now you can make some headway. Remember, if you lose 3 unupgraded batallions to destroy 1 FU Ranger batallion, you just about broke even -- unless the Rangers came from an inn. (And you probably have 6 barracks to his 1 archery range, so you can replace 6 lost batallions faster than he can replace 2.)

    So, incidentally, destroy all inns. Capture them if you can, but destroy them BEFORE you capture them, so not only does the enemy need to take it back, he has to repair it too. (If the inn is close to your base and you think you can protect it, you could make hobbits. Hobbits in rock throwing mode actually are quite effective against buildings.)

    Consideration #1:
    You might invest in armor upgrades for your pikes. Don't bother with Silverthorn arrows or armor for your archers, though, because it's expensive and you're going to lose them all when Boromir blows his horn and Rangers Longshot everyone to death, or Boromir blows his horn and Rohirrim trample everyone, or Theodan does Glorius Charge and Rohirrim trample everyone.

    The basic idea is that MOTW have a lot of awesome army-killing abilities, but only every so often.

    If you attempt to use fully upgraded armies, you will lose your army and take so long producing another fully upgraded army that MOTW will have some of their timers reset by the time you get back there and you'll lose them all again.

    So go with Elven Spam. Many barracks, no upgrades, just swamp him and try to keep your builders going with more trees, replacing them as they get destroyed and harassing the MOTW constantly around the map.

    Consideration #2:
    You might consider Elrond or Legolas or Glorfindel. Legolas protected by pikes can do some damage and gain levels fast if you keep using his double-shot just to get some unit kills. Elrond helps by bringing leadership. Glorfindel can work anti-harassment to chase down lone cavalry units that might be harassing your trees.

    All heroes suck versus massed fire archers, though, so lately I've been skipping them versus MOTW.


    Mordor strategies

    The Massive Orc Spam

    Build Order
    -orc pit + slaughterhouse
    -orc pit
    -slaughterhouse
    -orc pit
    -slaughterhouse
    -orc pit
    -slaughterhouse
    -orc pit
    -Nazgul/Mouth of Sauron
    -2 slaughterhouses
    -4 orc pits near the enemy base
    -Siege works -> get catapults/Fellbeast/Troll cage -> Attack trolls

    Description
    Basically, you rush your opponent with massive amounts of orcs. It is a feared strategy, and very popular in Tournament/Quickmatch games. Your objective is to attack from all sides with orcs, giving the enemy no chance to attack you or tech up.

    Orc rush to quick Attack Trolls

    Build Order
    SH
    orc pit < from here you start pumping out orcs as much as possible
    orc pit
    harrass with a few orc batts
    SH
    SH
    orc pit
    SH
    orc pit
    SH
    troll cage
    SH

    Description
    basically, while you're pumping out orcs you're expanding and getting a reasonable econ. then after your 4th orc pit you build a troll cage and all the time pumping out orcs and harrassing the enemy. then you start looking to getting troll cage upgrades and eventually a few attack trolls. all the time pumping out orcs! then you take a couple of orc batts aside and put them with your attack trolls and look for the open flank into the enemy base. once found, use and abuse! charge through with your attack trolls and orc escort and go straight for the juggular, or the fortress, depending how you feel. once that is down, which should go down quickly, hit the barracks and stables and archery ranges. after that your enemy should be gone.

    EXTRA: Zimland's advice 1

    Total Orc Spam --
    Orc pits and more orc pits and more orc pits. Just keep sending orcs. Throw in Catapults later on. This is pretty effective because it doesn't take a big economy to fund 8 orc pits full time and your enemy may simply have trouble killing them faster than you can make them, at which time, he loses. If nothing else, Orc Spam can hold an enemy back while you work on something more deadly.

    Mumakil --
    Mumakil are mainly for fighting elves, I find. Elves tend to go very heavy on archers and light on pikes. Micro the Mumakil enough to make sure it doesn't run over any full pikeman batallions. Charge the archers and smush em. Quite effective, even against Silverthorn arrows. Mumakil don't necessarily live a long time but they can usually create a big death toll for your enemy that he may have trouble recovering from fast enough to stop your orc hordes from overrunning him.

    Catapults --
    Probably the best "all around" option, it's hard to go wrong with Catapults. They're relatively cheap and quite nasty against basically everything.

    Nazghul --
    The 1000 resource mounted variety. I use them in basically every encounter. Nazghul require micro when mounted but they're handy for attacking cavalry and charging light archer groups. Don't charge big masses of archers because 4 batallions of Loriens will waste a Nazghul in seconds, silverthorn or no. On foot, though, they're fairly tough and mix in well with your troops.

    Haradrim Palace --
    Since v1.03, Haradrim Archers are actually quite good. Their damage is pretty good and their hit points are quite high. Expensive, though. If you can afford it, a FU Haradrim Archer army is capable of taking on a FU Ranger army. Course, you'll be spending more to do the same thing, but still. You wouldn't be amiss to mix in Haradrim and Easterlings with your orcs.


    Other than those general plans, I would say one build order:
    SH
    Orc pit
    Orc pit
    SH

    I use that initial BO for every single battle. Orc pits and orcs build slowly enough that you really need 2 pits and you need them early, just to create a force capable of holding the enemy while you work on something to back them up with.

    Couple other things:
    Orc Archers -- mandatory when fighting dwarves or another Mordor. Also good when fighting Goblin spammers. Not worthwhile versus MOTW or Elven archer armies. Probably worthwhile versus MOTW infantry armies but hardly anyone does that.

    Attack Trolls -- Overated, in my opinion. I usually only make them as a game ender in a match where I'm already pretty sure to win and I just want to hurry it up. Good players will not be surprised by the "secret troll rush" and it's a good way to waste a lot of money.

    Mountain Trolls -- Underated. Note that in melee mode, they are the only Mordor unit capable of healing itself (by eating an orc). Fight some, eat an orc, fight some more, etc. Picking up a tree cancels this option, though.

    Drummer Trolls -- Quite devastating versus melee armies but too slow and easily killed to be worth a lot. They do come with a handy Fear ability, though. I sometimes like to build one. They do kick the crap out of enemy Orc armies, though because their attacks hit a pretty wide swath in front of them.

    EXTRA: Zimland's advice 2

    Mordor vs Men:
    I think there are a lot of valid ways to approach this fight.

    What I've been doing lately, though, is very similar to Elven Spam, just with Orcs and Easterlings and Haradrim Archers.

    On small maps, you might worry about swordsman rushes and stick with Orcs until you're sure things are going ok. On bigger maps, Haradrim are a pretty safe bet. As money comes in, go with multiple Palaces and start upgrading them so you have the option to make Haradrim Archers.

    If MOTW are cavalry heavy, make more Easterlings. If MOTW are Ranger heavy, make more Haradrim. Likely, you'll need a mix of both and you might as well keep sending in orcs, because orcs are cheap and fodderous and can give your better units a chance to close the distance without getting killed.

    You might want to get the Mouth of Sauron but his main role is going to be harassment. He'll die too quickly once MOTW start getting fire arrows. Harass stuff, kill creeps, work anti-harassment duty if there's ever a lone group of horses running around, etc, then run in and debuff the enemy, or run in and do Dissension, then run away. Don't use the Mouth on the frontline of a big battle unless you're winning it.

    Strategically, you want to push towards the enemy base. Don't chase his Rohirrim all over the place. If you get a clump of 5 Easterling batallions and set Defensive Stance and click on the enemy base and MOTW are 100% Rohirrim, he's in big trouble. He can't trample you. He can shoot you up with arrows but not before you get all the way to his base and start wrecking the place.

    Just remember to always, always leave some Easterlings at home. A couple batallions should be standing around, so if you run to the enemy base and he runs to yours, you have a little defense to hold him off while you work his base over. Also, try to buy the moat (1500 resources) when you can, as this really cuts down Rohirrim ability to destroy your fortress in a sneak attack.


    Other options:
    - Attack Trolls (risky and expensive -- easily countered by Tower Guards)
    - Mumakil (ditto, but sometimes fun to bring 1 in)
    - Catapults (a pretty good option, I just think massed Haradrim/Easterlings/Orcs is faster to win with)


    Isengard strategies

    The Zerk Rush

    Build Order
    -2 Furnaces
    -Warg pit
    -Warg (use to harass straight away)
    -Furnace
    -Warg (defend and get outposts)
    -Uruk Pit and Furnace
    -Pikemen/Crossbows to defend your base (depends on the situation)
    -Furnace
    -Upgrade pit
    -4 Berserkers (zerks)
    -Rush the fortress, use warchant

    Description
    The idea is that you harass and attack wargs early, and get 4 zerks as soon as possible, rush the enemy's fortress and take it down along with all available unit producing structures. Since war chant only lasts so long, there is precious little time to execute this devastating attack successfully. If done right, this attack should kill an enemy very very quickly. You should not need to produce anything more than wargs and zerks to make this strategy work.

    Replay
    Watch it here!


    Goblin strategies

    Basic Goblin strategy

    Build Order
    Cave
    Tunnel
    Cave
    Tunnel
    Tunnel
    Cave
    Spider Pit
    Level 2 Spider Pit
    Tunnel
    Cave
    Fissure
    Armory
    Tunnel
    Fissure

    Description
    You just have to spam gobs early game and put them in agresive and hit his buildings. Farms first, then production building. Now he should be focused on stopping the Goblins, and you should be able to build a Pit and get it level two. Now in your waves of Goblins throw in Spider Riders. If he uses pikes switch them to bows, and they'll pit pike apart. Also, Poison BLade w/ Gobs is useful. If you can't stop soldiers, get Archers, but not an excessive amount.
    Now, you have a great econemy so we'll build a cave to increase wave size, and a Fissure. Get Half Trolls and send them in unupgraded, these guys are still tough - they can survive a longbow shot from rangers. Now that our armory is up, get heavy armor and blades, start spamming Half Trolls, they'll tear through buildings, and nothing can really hurt a FU Half Troll. With two Fissures pumping them out, you should have hi down in now time. If you can though, take him out before it gets mid-late game.

    General goblin spam to marauders

    Build order
    -tunnel + goblin cave
    -tunnel
    -goblin cave
    -2 tunnels
    -fissure
    -treasure trove, get heavy armor and forged blades
    -2 tunnels
    -spider pit

    Description
    Basically spam goblins all the time and build as many tunnels as you need to keep your army large. Then as you continue get a fissure and get half trolls. Once you have enough money get the heavy armour upgrade and any troops that you send to war upgrade them. Most importantly you must always have units attacking the enemy, otherwise they will gain the upper hand.


    The Hall of Fame! Everyone who contributed to the databank gets his acknowledgement here. Thanks to:

  • Bendak
  • Zimland
  • L0rd Wolf
  • Lagomorphic
  • scrat master
  • Kaelith
  • merting
  • Victor von Doom
  • RedN0mad
  • Shawdster


    B e n d e r s . . . 2004

    ex SWGBH scn designer
    ex BFME2H cherub

    [This message has been edited by Bendak (edited 02-15-2007 @ 08:10 AM).]

  • AuthorReplies:
    Scorch062
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-20-07 10:49 PM EDT (US)     176 / 232       
    Wow this is quite built up im gonna use this

    ".`.rh, rmg hrg .`."
    "Executing order 66 my lord"
    "If we're all clones, why am I the only one with a sense of humor?"
    BFME2 Replay Reviewer
    Smeagolfan24
    WICH Fanfic Moderator
    posted 04-20-07 11:23 PM EDT (US)     177 / 232       
    Good. Glad you found it useful.

    Isn't it little... weak in Big maps?

    I thought all maps were the same size... If there are larger maps, then I don't see why the Orc rush would be any worse, besides the obvious fact that they'd get to the enemy base slower.


    .:|Smeagol|:.
    World in Conflict Heaven Cherub
    Battle For Middle-earth II Heaven Replay Reviewer and Ledgend

    Where did I go wrong? I lost a friend somewhere along in the bitterness.
    Oh, I would have stayed up with you all night, had I known how to save a life...
    GeneralVon
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-21-07 00:06 AM EDT (US)     178 / 232       
    im a really good microist and when im playing mordor i never have time to sit and watch the battles. theres always something to do with them. very hard race to use.

    also, fire arrow rush??? lol. a calv rush would destroy you without a problem.

    also, its possible to kill a troll lair with orcs. you underestimate them alot!

    you will need to micro them quit a bit though and need about 4 groups. (and buff)


    a good rushing strat with any race is usually just a resource building and barracks. get out some infantry and take down their resource buildings. but if your rush fails you end up crippling yourself and your early-mid game economy will be tough to deal with.

    or make 2 resource buildings and then a barracks. this is a better economy strat for early-mid game but! ... the enemy will be ready for your attack.

    or just take both ur builders to the enemy base and attack with those. i've tried this stretagy before it works really good. you need to get the rambo upgrade and upgrade both those builders into rambos. they get the job done with a bag of rocks, unless! you get the bazooka upgrade for them. either way they get they do it in style.

    [This message has been edited by GeneralVon (edited 04-21-2007 @ 00:08 AM).]

    Ludson
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-21-07 05:27 AM EDT (US)     179 / 232       
    When I tried the orc spam in the big map, I got owned big time. Probably did something wrong, and the player was really good ranked though. He said to me that orc spam isn't useful in big maps. Just wanted to ask your opinion...
    Smeagolfan24
    WICH Fanfic Moderator
    posted 04-21-07 08:58 AM EDT (US)     180 / 232       
    With an orc rush, the main probkem people have is not having enough units to be everywhere at once. You can avoid this by making...

    Slaughter house --> Orc Pit --> Slaughter house --> 2-3 hordes of orcs --> Orc Pit --> 2-3 hordes of orcs --> Slaughter house

    This has worked for me in the past.


    .:|Smeagol|:.
    World in Conflict Heaven Cherub
    Battle For Middle-earth II Heaven Replay Reviewer and Ledgend

    Where did I go wrong? I lost a friend somewhere along in the bitterness.
    Oh, I would have stayed up with you all night, had I known how to save a life...
    Scorch062
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-22-07 08:27 AM EDT (US)     181 / 232       
    Yeh thats a good tactic, but i like to create as many hords as i can at the start but because they are cheap the money goes up faster so i put more slaughter houses down and then get more money

    ".`.rh, rmg hrg .`."
    "Executing order 66 my lord"
    "If we're all clones, why am I the only one with a sense of humor?"
    BFME2 Replay Reviewer
    Smeagolfan24
    WICH Fanfic Moderator
    posted 04-22-07 10:52 AM EDT (US)     182 / 232       
    Very true.

    .:|Smeagol|:.
    World in Conflict Heaven Cherub
    Battle For Middle-earth II Heaven Replay Reviewer and Ledgend

    Where did I go wrong? I lost a friend somewhere along in the bitterness.
    Oh, I would have stayed up with you all night, had I known how to save a life...
    Ludson
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-22-07 11:24 AM EDT (US)     183 / 232       
    Another question... When I get done the first orc pit and I start to make orcs, should I send them immediatly when they get out or gather few battallions and then attack?
    Smeagolfan24
    WICH Fanfic Moderator
    posted 04-22-07 11:27 AM EDT (US)     184 / 232       
    Two or three, but no more than three should do it. I normally do it in pairs.

    .:|Smeagol|:.
    World in Conflict Heaven Cherub
    Battle For Middle-earth II Heaven Replay Reviewer and Ledgend

    Where did I go wrong? I lost a friend somewhere along in the bitterness.
    Oh, I would have stayed up with you all night, had I known how to save a life...
    GeneralVon
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-22-07 03:37 PM EDT (US)     185 / 232       
    depends on what map. for example, on fords of isen get your first group to go on the bottom side of the map, then ur second group on the top and by this time you should have ur second pit up. so when 2 orcs come out have them go up the middle and attack from all 3 sides and keep the music going. on bigger maps like iron hills i group my units in pairs of 2 also when spamming orcs >>> always have a group of archers in your base. your first invest should be the doom pyers then nazgul(s), trolls/muma/upgrades/more heroes.
    Smeagolfan24
    WICH Fanfic Moderator
    posted 04-22-07 03:57 PM EDT (US)     186 / 232       
    Psst, GV.

    your first invest should be the doom pyers then nazgul(s), trolls/muma/upgrades/more heroes.

    I disagree. Mumakil are worthless, and you should probably get the Mouth before upgrades, as he can be easily leveled up with the many lairs there. This is all after you begin your waves of orcs, of course.


    .:|Smeagol|:.
    World in Conflict Heaven Cherub
    Battle For Middle-earth II Heaven Replay Reviewer and Ledgend

    Where did I go wrong? I lost a friend somewhere along in the bitterness.
    Oh, I would have stayed up with you all night, had I known how to save a life...
    GeneralVon
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-22-07 11:56 PM EDT (US)     187 / 232       
    mumakills are anti everything (even heroes) except pikemen. very usefull for killing those annoying heroes. you have no idea what your talking about.

    also, lairs should be your primary. you should go for them, gives you the boost you need to out-do your enemy.

    if you can kill lairs with mouth of sauron, your playing a noobie.

    [This message has been edited by GeneralVon (edited 04-23-2007 @ 00:00 AM).]

    Smeagolfan24
    WICH Fanfic Moderator
    posted 04-23-07 07:30 AM EDT (US)     188 / 232       
    mumakills are anti everything (even heroes) except pikemen. very usefull for killing those annoying heroes.

    They're too expensive for their low health and reliability. It's just not worth it when you can get Fellbeasts to do the same job.

    you have no idea what your talking about

    An example of how we could have had a constructive debate, and then ruined by a minor insult.

    lairs should be your primary. you should go for them,

    Getting a hero (like the nazgul) to level two can not only get a power for the hero, but also boost your economy. These are for the lairs that you can reach easily; the ones between the players you should get as soon as you can with units.

    if you can kill lairs with mouth of sauron, your playing a noobie.

    Not the ones that only you can get on account of their location.


    .:|Smeagol|:.
    World in Conflict Heaven Cherub
    Battle For Middle-earth II Heaven Replay Reviewer and Ledgend

    Where did I go wrong? I lost a friend somewhere along in the bitterness.
    Oh, I would have stayed up with you all night, had I known how to save a life...
    MightyFireball
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-23-07 10:05 AM EDT (US)     189 / 232       
    I never found a real use for Mumakil, they fall very fast to upgraded archers as well as pikemen. Almost every army includes at least one of these, so they get killed very easily in my experience.

    Smoke Rings Award Winner
    Chill with me.
    Smeagolfan24
    WICH Fanfic Moderator
    posted 04-23-07 04:12 PM EDT (US)     190 / 232       
    Exactly.

    .:|Smeagol|:.
    World in Conflict Heaven Cherub
    Battle For Middle-earth II Heaven Replay Reviewer and Ledgend

    Where did I go wrong? I lost a friend somewhere along in the bitterness.
    Oh, I would have stayed up with you all night, had I known how to save a life...
    MightyFireball
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-23-07 04:28 PM EDT (US)     191 / 232       
    GeneralVon, I'd like to hear your pro-Mumakil arguments. I've never found a use for them, but if you have, then I'd love to hear about it.

    Smoke Rings Award Winner
    Chill with me.
    Shawdster
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-23-07 06:15 PM EDT (US)     192 / 232       
    Mumakill are too slow to be effective in my case, besides,they fall too easily to upgraded archers *cough*fire-arrow-ranger-rush*cough*
    Ludson
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-24-07 12:09 PM EDT (US)     193 / 232       
    if you can kill lairs with mouth of sauron, your playing a noobie.

    I don't understand what that means...


    I find mumakills often useless, because I like to recruit nazguls and mouth of sauron and harass the enemy archers and footmen. After that they are swarming with pikemen, so I really have no place for Mumakill that time.

    Mumakill can be good, if you can get them to enemy base and enemy doesn't have any pikemen at the moment.

    Edit: ps. How can you lend other users words to your post? Most forums have the button for that, but I can't seem find any here... :E

    [This message has been edited by Ludson (edited 04-24-2007 @ 12:11 PM).]

    Odins Servant
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-24-07 01:32 PM EDT (US)     194 / 232       
    Do you mean to quote?

    Here


    GeneralVon
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-24-07 05:44 PM EDT (US)     195 / 232       
    mumakills own everything except upgraded arrows.

    if you walk over pikemen then your mumakill deserves to die. you dont walk over pikemen. you just attack the pikemen or just simply avoid the pikemen.

    Mumakills are well worth it. Plus they come with range support (250) so your basicly paying about 1500 for a mumakill.
    note : Never leave the harad spear throwers on the mumakill. They dont help as much. They are better on foot.

    (for smeagal) > I bet by the time you get a level 2 nazgul I will have out a 3 nazguls or just 1 fellbeast. im pritty sure you dont even play online ... im not sure why your even trying to say stuff about it when you obviously never played any very good players lol. I know what im talking about and lairs should be your primary. (doesn't mean you cant do 2 things at once. kill lairs and do a rush)

    im not trying to be mean or anything but I am telling you that your wrong and that theres a better way to do it.

    I know a good stretagy for a fast mumakill and trust me the enemy never expects a fast mumakill. But to do this you need to skip getting any heroes and it takes skill to do it.

    This is why mordors my best (besides isenguard) race to play with. A very good mordor player is very unpredictable. You dont know what your going up against.
    Ludson
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-25-07 10:12 AM EDT (US)     196 / 232       
    Man, I just played game and I won it by getting enemy to give up, but it bothers me. I usuaally get with mordor the enemy to build like lots of towers and stuff near his fortress and camp there. I control every else in the map. The problems just is, I can't seem to get the enemy defense tower line defeated. Everytime I go in with few catapult and units, their heroes just come to kill my catapults and then leave. This have happened me many times. Any good strategy to kill those idiotic towers?

    BTW: Mumakill owns heroes IMO. I saw when my teammate just crushed 4 enemy +5 lvl heroes by one mumakill in few seconds. That was cool. Can you tell your good mumakill strategy please? For the sake of the community?

    [This message has been edited by Ludson (edited 04-25-2007 @ 10:13 AM).]

    Smeagolfan24
    WICH Fanfic Moderator
    posted 04-25-07 04:24 PM EDT (US)     197 / 232       
    It seems I am wrong. Share your strategy.

    .:|Smeagol|:.
    World in Conflict Heaven Cherub
    Battle For Middle-earth II Heaven Replay Reviewer and Ledgend

    Where did I go wrong? I lost a friend somewhere along in the bitterness.
    Oh, I would have stayed up with you all night, had I known how to save a life...
    GeneralVon
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-25-07 07:17 PM EDT (US)     198 / 232       
    ya, ill post it up in the stretagy central as "Mordors Mumas" dont follow my stretagies exactly though anyone. adjust it to fit your gamestyle.
    TheBlackAdmiral
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-29-07 05:04 AM EDT (US)     199 / 232       
    Siege Rush

    For Dwarves

    BO:
    Mine + Hall of Warriors
    Mine
    Guardians (Start harrasing enemy builders, don't get in range of the fort)
    Mine
    2 Guardians (Destroy his barracks)
    Forge Works
    2 Guardians (Harrass enemy buildings)
    Demolisher
    2 Guardians
    Glon
    Demolisher
    keep pumping out more Guardians, Phalanx if the opponent starts building Cavalry. Replace any slain Demolishers as soon as possible.

    Explanation:

    After you have built a Demolisher, make it go to the enemy base and knock down his most important buildings (Barracks, Archery Range, Stables, depends what units your opponent prefers). This should cripple your opponent enough to let Glon paired with a Demolisher and a couple of Guardians give the killing blow.

    I find this tactic to be very useful against Goblins and Elves, since Goblins usually don't have anything spectacularly powerful in early game and Elves are too few in number to pose a real threat to your sturdy Dwarves. Beware of Archers though, they can quickly reduce the numbers of your Guardian units, so destroy Archery ranges as quickly as possible. Lastly, this tactic is hardly effective against Mordor, since they can bring Easterlings quite quickly and Easterlings are just a pip to powerful to take on with Guardians only. If you feel that Guardians just don't do the job, feel free to change them to Axe Throwers, they work fine and aren't more expensive.

    For Isengard

    BO:
    Furnace
    Uruk-pit
    Furnace
    Uruk-hai
    Lumber Mill
    2 Uruk-hai
    Siege Works
    2 Uruk-hai
    Battering Ram
    2 Uruk-hai
    Battering Ram
    Grma Wormtongue/Lurtz
    Keep on Pumping out Uruk-hai or Uruk Pikemen, replace any slain Battering Ram

    Explanation:
    Use the first battalions of Uruk-hai to make sure that the enemy doesn't expand too much, but keep out of range of the Fortress. When you have your Battering Rams and Grima or Lurtz, kill/convert (grima) the enemies while battering down production buildings, get your second ram to knock down the most important buildings. If you choose to knock down production buildings first, you might want to make the enemy "bleed to death" by razing all production buildings and killing all builders before mustering enough force to knock down the Fortress.

    This tactic as (again) most effective against Goblins and Elves, You'll have trouble with Mordor, but it is still easier to take down Mordor with Isengard than it is with Dwarves. The greatest differences between Dwarves and Isengard are that Isengard is faster, but takes longer to produce the same amount of battalions and that Demolishers are significantly harder to take down.


    I hope you like them.

    GeneralVon
    Dúnadan
    posted 04-29-07 11:37 AM EDT (US)     200 / 232       
    is that seige rush for 4000 starting resources??

    a simple regular one for isenguard and dwarfs are just 2 resource buildings 97% or higher then foward a seige base (out of sight). get a seige unit out. sell the seige building and build barracks in your base. works much better.

    lumber mills are useless early game. your better off making a resource building near your fort. lumber mills are very good for isenguards "fuel the fires". that power is actually OP (over powered) at the moment. so take advantage of it! . it gives you 100%+ resources where on the clanwar patch it only gives you 50%+ resources .

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